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An associate was born here and grew up here in Canada. Subsequently he
moved to the U.S.A. and acquired U.S. citizenship in January 1977 through
naturalization. No request to Canadian authorities was made to renounce his
Canadian citizenship. This person still considers he has Canadian
citizenship. Is this the case?
If not, can he challenge any arbitrary loss
of his citizenship without his agreement? Would he need to apply for a
Canadian passport indicating the date he was naturalized in the U.S to find
out if the Canadian Governments still considers him a Canadian?
If they deem
him to have lost his citizenship, what are the grounds for doing so? Could
he challenge this legally? No due process! Any court challenges overturning
loss of Citizenship cases? Thanks. K
==========================================
david ingram replies:
There have been many challenges, particularly by children whose parents becamne citizens of another country prior to Feb 15, 1977.
Government asked to allow 'lost children' to claim Canadian citizenship
Last Updated Wed, 29 Jan 2003 1:11:25
OTTAWA - The federal immigration minister is being urged to restore the citizenship of thousands of people who lost their status when their parents became citizens of other countries.
People affected took their case to a parliamentary committee that's reviewing a proposed new Citizenship Act. They say they never stopped being Canadian when their families moved out of the country.
In front of disbelieving MPs, Magali Castro-Gyr held up her valid Canadian passport, her birth certificate showing she was born in Montreal in 1959, and a Canadian citizenship award her 10-year-old son received recently. But Ottawa says Castro-Gyr and her sons aren't Canadian.
"I said (to my son) 'What would you say to this committee for me?' He said, 'Mom, tell them this, I am Canadian, and tell them with capital letters with an exclamation mark!'"
Castro-Gyr only discovered she wasn't Canadian two years ago, when she tried to get citizenship papers for her children. They'd been born in Switzerland and she was returning to Canada to teach in British Columbia.
Citizenship officials told her she'd lost her citizenship as a child, when her father moved the family to the United States and he himself became an American citizen.
"It becomes truly irrational and absurd to disentitle a Canadian-born child from his or her ability to retain Canadian citizenship, solely on the actions taken by her father," said Castro-Gyr.
But the Citizenship Act of 1947 said children were essentially property of their fathers and lost citizenship if their fathers did. The law was changed in 1977, but that was too late for Castro-Gyr.
It was also too late for Dan Chapman. The 48-year-old airline pilot lost his citizenship at the age of seven, when his father went to the United States. Chapman is bitter about it.
"If there was ever a lesson to be learned in 1940s Germany it's that you never create a class of people and take away all their rights. When you do that bad things happen, so you just don't go there. But Canada has gone there, so it's time to correct it," he said.
But Canadian officials have only suggested Castro-Gyr and Chapman apply for landed immigrant status. As former Canadians they'll only have to reside in Canada one year, instead of the usual three for everyone else.
But both think it's an insult. Castro-Gyr has spent $20,000 fighting the issue in Federal Court.
"It's an emotional connection that I have with Canada. I am not an immigrant, OK? I am born here. Yes, I left for the United States as a minor child, but we kept ties with Canada through my entire life," she said.
But in Chapman's case, the fact that his great-great-uncle was one of the first judges appointed to the Supreme Court of Canada doesn't help him.
Canadian Alliance House leader John Reynolds says Canada doesn't want to restore their citizenship because it might mean thousands of people returning to claim health and social benefits.
"They're good people, they're hard-working people, they want to be Canadians, and because of a little glitch in the law, which I think is totally against human rights - and if it goes to the Supreme Court I'm sure it will be ruled they'll get it back. But I think there's a good feeling in this committee even from the Liberals, that they couldn't believe it when they heard this story."
Reynolds believes the time is right for change. Immigration Minister Denis Coderre is proposing the first overhaul to Canada's citizenship laws in 25 years. Reynolds wants it to include an amendment to restore citizenship for people who wouldn't have lost it under today's laws.
But Coderre isn't ready to do that. "I won't make a general statement about the situation. I'm willing to look at some specific cases I've heard. Mr. Reynolds and other members of Parliament show me some cases, I'm going take a closer look at that, but there's some situations I'm ready to take a look at."
But Chapman and Castro-Gyr aren't interested in dealing with the issue case by case. They say nothing short of welcoming back the people they consider Canada's "lost children," is good enough.
Written by CBC News Online staff
Canada did not allow Dual Citizenship until (believe it or not) Feb 15, 1977.
To quote from my October, 1993 Newsletter.
October 1993 Page 1-7
the CEN-TA PEDE
david ingram's US/Canadian Newsletter
DUAL CITIZENS - CANADA / UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
This also applies to a US citizen / landed immigrant in Canada or to a Canadian with a US Green Card and maintaining Canadian ties or to a Status Indian (not on a reserve) and working in Canada or living in Canada while working in the U.S.
Much of the following is "word for word" from a pamphlet called DUAL CITIZENSHIP published by Multiculturalism and Citizenship Canada. This pamphlet is written from the Canadian perspective. I have added the American perspective and my version is far more ominous than the rather tame Canadian Version. Other parts are taken "word for word" from identified US publications.
[Plain Paragraphs without [square brackets] are from the Canadian pamphlet word for word. BOLD FACED Paragraphs inside [square brackets] are my interpretation of the problem for US / Canada Dual Citizens. Please note that my remarks would be completely different for Australia, New Zealand, Great Britain / Canada versions. This is because these countries and Canada do not tax their citizens on their world income (but still tax income sourced within the country) when they do not live in the country unless the citizen maintains close and continuous economic ties with their parent country and then the income usually needs to be earned active income in the form of wages or business income rather than passive investment.]
Italic items inside {Squiggly brackets} refer to items issued by the United States Consulate General. These items are available directly from: the Consulate General of the United States of America, American Citizenship Unit, 1095 West Pender Street, Vancouver, B. C., V6E 2M6, (604) 685-4311. The specific US items used in this treatise (in no particular order) are: M-321 dated 6-84 and titled PASSPORT SERVICES; VAC 103 0001p-34 dated 03/91 and titled INFORMATION ABOUT POSSIBLE LOSS OF US CITIZENSHIP; VAC 31 0001p-17 dated 04/91 and titled AMENDMENTS TO CITIZENSHIP REGULATIONS.
[I have kept the topic headings and added my own interpretations with particular respect as to the special problems that US/Canada dual citizens have. Please note that an American does not suffer by acquiring Canadian Citizenship as a rule. Canadians on the other hand sometimes fall into a tax horror show if they acquire US residency while they continue to work in Canada. This is because they only look at the difference between the two federal tax rates and do not pay any attention to the heavier FICA taxes in the U.S., the gift taxes in the U.S., the inheritance taxes in the US or even the heavier user fees in the US. The US citizen does not consider it a tax horror show because he or she has grown up with that system and sees it as normal].
INFORMATION ABOUT POSSIBLE LOSS OF US CITIZENSHIP
The Department of State is responsible for determining the citizenship status of a person located outside the United States.
The United States does not officially favour dual nationality as a matter of policy, but does recognize its existence in individual cases.
Under US law, acquisition of citizenship of a foreign country upon one's own application after one's 18th birthday is potentially expatriating and can result in the loss of US citizenship. However, in order to find a loss, court decisions have determined that the action must be both voluntary and with the "intent to lose" US citizenship.
The standards used in adjudicating such cases are based on the premise that US nationals intend to keep their US nationality when they obtain the nationality of another country [Note - this also leaves the US able to continue to tax US nationals who take out Canadian Citizenship], when they make a pro forma declaration of allegiance to another country or when they accept a non-policy level position in another country.
There are no specific steps you can take in advance of naturalization as a Canadian citizen to protect your US citizenship and a consular officer cannot provide any assurance that you will be able to retain it. However, in all cases in which Canadian citizenship was acquired without the intent of relinquishing US citizenship, the Department of State has determined that an individual may continue to be documented as a US citizen. Nevertheless, each case must be adjudicated individually.
It should be noted that it is still possible to lose US citizenship by holding a policy level position in a foreign government, by acquiring foreign citizenship with the intent of relinquishing US citizenship, or by formally renouncing US citizenship before a US consular officer.
If you have become a Canadian citizen and wish to have a determination made as to whether you may continue to be documented as a US citizen, you should contact this [the Vancouver] office telephonically, or in person during the hours of 9:00 a.m. - 1:30 p.m., Monday to Friday, except US/Canadian holidays, for further information. VAC 103, 0001p-34 03/91.
WHAT IS MEANT BY DUAL CITIZENSHIP?
Every independent nation makes its own decision as to who its citizens are. You possess dual or multiple citizenship when more than one country recognizes you as its citizen.
Unlike the "Citizenship Act" in effect in Canada until 1977, the present Act allows a Canadian citizen to acquire foreign nationality without automatically losing Canadian citizenship. Since February 15, 1977, a Canadian citizen may retain Canadian citizenship, unless he or she voluntarily applies to renounce it, "and" the application is "approved" by a citizenship judge. The present Act thus makes it possible to have two or more citizenships and allegiances at the same time for an indefinite period.
You can read the rest by going to http://www.centa.com/CEN-TAPEDE/october_1993.htm
Therefore, there is no doubt that "officially", your friend has lost his Canadian Citizenship.
If I was him, I would just apply for my Canadian Passport. If it is issued, he is a citizen, it is not issued, he would have to go through the immigration process to come back to Canada. Believe me, he is not alone.
And, I expect (and hope) that this answer will get a couple of comments from immigration attorneys and consultants.
David Ingram's US/Canada Services
US / Canada / Mexico tax and working Visa Specialists
US / Canada Real Estate Specialists
4466 Prospect Road
North Vancouver, BC, CANADA, V7N 3L7
Calls accepted from 10 AM to 10 PM 7 days a week
Res (604) 980-3578 Cell (604) 657-8451
Bus (604) 980-0321
[email protected]
www.centa.com www.david-ingram.com
Disclaimer: This question has been answered without detailed information or consultation and is to be regarded only as general comment. Nothing in this message is or should be construed as advice in any particular circumstances. No contract exists between the reader & the author and any and all non-contractual duties are expressly denied. All readers should obtain formal advice from a competent financial, or real estate planner or advisor & appropriately qualified legal practitioner, tax or immigration specialist in connection with personal or business affairs such as at www.centa.com. If you forward this message, this disclaimer must be included."
This from "ask an income tax and immigration and bankruptcy expert" from www.centa.com or www.jurock.com or www.featureweb.com. Canadian David Ingram deals daily with tax returns dealing with expatriate:
multi jurisdictional cross and trans border expatriate problems for the United States, Canada, Mexico, Great Britain, the United Kingdom, Kuwait, Dubai, Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt, Antarctica, Japan, China, New Zealand, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Russia, Georgia, Brazil, Peru, Ecuador, Bolivia, Scotland, Ireland, Hawaii, Florida, Montana, Morocco, Israel, Iraq, Iran, India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Mali, Bangkok, Greenland, Iceland, Cuba, Bahamas, Bermuda, Barbados, St Vincent, Grenada,, Virgin Islands, US, UK, GB, American and Canadian and Mexican and any of the 43 states with state tax returns, etc.
income tax wizard wizzard guru advisor specialist consultant taxman preparer of Alaska, Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona,
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and Dallas Houston Rockwall Garland
Texas Taxman and Tax Guru and wizzard
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another similar question will be as we lump them.
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If the number of messages is too many for you or the US / Canada Taxation and Immigration information is not of interest, simply reply with a remove request.
David Ingram of the CEN-TA REALTY Group
US / Canada / Mexico tax and working Visa Specialists
US / Canada Real Estate Specialists
4466 Prospect Road
North Vancouver, BC, CANADA, V7N 3L7
(604) 980-0321 - Fax 913-9123 [email protected]
www.centa.com www.david-ingram.com
This from "ask an income tax and immigration and bankruptcy expert" from www.centa.com or www.jurock.com or www.featureweb.com. Canadian David Ingram deals daily with tax returns dealing with expatriate:
multi jurisdictional cross and trans border expatriate problems for the United States, Canada, Mexico, Great Britain, the United Kingdom, Kuwait, Dubai, Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt, Antarctica, Japan, China, New Zealand, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Russia, Georgia, Brazil, Peru, Ecuador, Bolivia, Scotland, Ireland, Hawaii, Florida, Montana, Morocco, Israel, Iraq, Iran, India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Mali, Bangkok, Greenland, Iceland, Cuba, Bahamas, Bermuda, Barbados, St Vincent, Grenada,, Virgin Islands, US, UK, GB, American and Canadian and Mexican and any of the 43 states with state tax returns, etc.
income tax wizard wizzard guru advisor specialist consultant taxman preparer of Alaska, Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona,
California, Colorado, Connecticut,
Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida,
Garland, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois,
Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky,
Louisiana, Maine, Maryland,
Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota,
Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska,
Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey,
New Mexico,New York, North Carolina,
North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon.
Paris, Rome, Sydney, Australia Hilton
Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Rockwall,
South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee,
Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia,
West Virginia, Wisconsin, Wyoming,
British Columbia, Alberta, Saskatchewan,
Manitoba, Ontario, Quebec City,
New Brunswick, Prince Edward Island,
Nova Scotia, Newfoundland, Yukon and
Northwest and Nunavit Territories,
Mount Vernon, Eumenclaw, Coos Bay
and Dallas Houston Rockwall Garland
Texas Taxman and Tax Guru and wizzard
wizard -
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