Splitting capital gain and investment income, where should we attach the T5 &T3 to? - international non-resident cross
        		
1.        For the last 7 years I have declared all the capital gains and investment income of our joint account and my individual account on my income tax return which is pure ignorance and to our disadvantage even though the the total amount was not large. 
2.        Now we want to declare 50%/50% of our capital gain and investment income of our joint account because the amount is becoming quite significant.
    
3.        Can we just ignore the past and start to do this now?Do we need to explain to CRA?Do I need to attach all the T5 and T3 slips on both of our returns?(Then we would have no copies of our own.)
    
We thank you very much for the help!
Regards. 
_________________________________________________________
david ingram replies:
1. Under Section 74.1 of the Canadian Income Tax Act, The account is taxable to the spouse who put the money into the account. Therefore, If you gave her $10,000 and she puts it into an account in her name, any earnings in that account on the first $10,000 is taxable to YOU forever. The earnings on the earnings are taxable to her however.
Therefore, if you put the money into the joint account seven years ago, any earnings on the original amount or any further amounts you put in are correctly taxable to you. These are called the 'Attribution Rules'.
But, if the earnings were left in the plan, 1/2 of the earnings on the earnings would be taxable to her.
On the other hand, if the joint account was an inheritance from her father and was put into a joint account, the reverse would be true and everything on the original amount would be taxable to her with 1/2 of the earnings on the earnings taxable to you.
The same is true of the individual accounts you have.
Your question is really based upon, 'what happens if you suddenly switched'? The answer is that in 43 years in this business with 155 offices of my own in 5 provinces and the management of H & R Block offices before that in three provinces, I have only seen the tax office go after two couples under the attribution rules. And that involves the preparation of well over 3,000,000 tax returns over .
The ONLY ones I saw were H & R Block clients in Saskatchewan. One was in Kipling Saskatchewan and the other in Weyburn Saskatchewan and I won both by tracing minor amounts of money that the wives had earned and saved during World War II as being justification for the husbands splitting the proceeds from the family farms which were sold 30 years later. The farms, of course, were only in the Husband's names under the VLA (Veteran's Land Act) rules but it was the $1,000 or $1,500 that the wives had saved which was used to get the farms going.
In your case, it may be that if you gave your wife the money, you were just paying her back while she supported you through electrical engineering.
 
In truth, you need to do a spread sheet and figure out what is what 'just in case'.
It may be that the split should be 38% <> 62% or 20% <> 80% or 49% <> 51% but you can certainly make the switch without much worry about being questioned by the CRA, particularly since Stephen Harper's government is clearly on track for a joint tax return sometime in the future.
_____________________________________________
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david ingram replies:
1. Under Section 74.1 of the Canadian Income Tax Act, The account is taxable to the spouse who put the money into the account. Therefore, If you gave her $10,000 and she puts it into an account in her name, any earnings in that account on the first $10,000 is taxable to YOU forever. The earnings on the earnings are taxable to her however.
Therefore, if you put the money into the joint account seven years ago, any earnings on the original amount or any further amounts you put in are correctly taxable to you. These are called the 'Attribution Rules'.
But, if the earnings were left in the plan, 1/2 of the earnings on the earnings would be taxable to her.
On the other hand, if the joint account was an inheritance from her father and was put into a joint account, the reverse would be true and everything on the original amount would be taxable to her with 1/2 of the earnings on the earnings taxable to you.
The same is true of the individual accounts you have.
Your question is really based upon, 'what happens if you suddenly switched'? The answer is that in 43 years in this business with 155 offices of my own in 5 provinces and the management of H & R Block offices before that in three provinces, I have only seen the tax office go after two couples under the attribution rules. And that involves the preparation of well over 3,000,000 tax returns over .
The ONLY ones I saw were H & R Block clients in Saskatchewan. One was in Kipling Saskatchewan and the other in Weyburn Saskatchewan and I won both by tracing minor amounts of money that the wives had earned and saved during World War II as being justification for the husbands splitting the proceeds from the family farms which were sold 30 years later. The farms, of course, were only in the Husband's names under the VLA (Veteran's Land Act) rules but it was the $1,000 or $1,500 that the wives had saved which was used to get the farms going.
In your case, it may be that if you gave your wife the money, you were just paying her back while she supported you through electrical engineering.
In truth, you need to do a spread sheet and figure out what is what 'just in case'.
It may be that the split should be 38% <> 62% or 20% <> 80% or 49% <> 51% but you can certainly make the switch without much worry about being questioned by the CRA, particularly since Stephen Harper's government is clearly on track for a joint tax return sometime in the future.
_____________________________________________
david ingram wrote: 
Calls welcomed from 10 AM to 9 PM 7 days a week Vancouver (LA) time - (please do not fax or phone outside of those hours as this is a home office)
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
$1,600 would be for two people with income from two countries
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Ingram expert income tax help and preparation of US Canada Mexico non-resident and cross border returns with rental dividend wages self-employed and royalty foreign tax credits family estate trust trusts income tax convention treaty
 
 
 
 
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Disclaimer:  This question has been answered without detailed 
information or consultation and is to be regarded only as general 
comment.   Nothing in this message is or should be construed as advice 
in any particular circumstances. No contract exists between the reader and the 
author and any and all non-contractual duties are expressly denied. All 
readers should obtain formal advice from a competent and 
appropriately qualified legal practitioner or tax specialist 
for expert help, assistance, preparation, 
or consultation  in connection with personal or 
business affairs such as at www.centa.com. If you forward this message, 
this disclaimer must be included."
Be ALERT,  the world needs more 
"lerts"
David Ingram gives expert income 
tax & immigration help to non-resident Americans & Canadians from 
New York to California to Mexico  family, 
estate, income trust trusts Cross border, dual citizen - out of 
country investments are all handled with competence & 
authority.
Phone consultations are $400 for 15 minutes to 50 
minutes (professional hour). Please note that GST is added if product remains in 
Canada or a phone consultation is in Canada.
This is not intended to be definitive but in 
general I am quoting $800 to $2,800 for a dual country tax return.
$800 would be one T4 slip one W2 slip one or two 
interest slips and you lived in one country only - no self employment or rentals 
or capital gains - you did not move into or out of the country in this 
year.
$1,000 would be the same with one rental 
$1,200 would be the same with one business no 
rental
$1,200 would be the minimum with a move in or out 
of the country. These are complicated because of the back and forth foreign tax 
credits. - The IRS says a foreign tax credit takes 1 hour and 53 
minutes.
$1,500 would be the minimum with a rental or two in 
the country you do not live in or a rental and a business and foreign tax 
credits  no move in or out 
$1,600 would be for two people with income from two countries
$2,800 would be all of the above and you moved in 
and out of the country.
This is just a guideline for US / Canadian 
returns
We will still prepare Canadian only (lives in 
Canada, no US connection period) with two or three slips and no capital 
gains, etc. for $150.00 up.
With a Rental for $350
A Business for $350 - Rental and business likely 
$450
And an American only (lives in the US with no 
Canadian income or filing period) with about the same things in the same range 
with a little bit more if there is a state return.
Moving in or out of the country or part year 
earnings in the US will ALWAYS be $800 and up.
TDF 90-22.1 forms are $50 for the first and $25.00 
each after that when part of a tax return.
8891 forms are generally $50.00 to $100.00 
each.
18 RRSPs would be $900.00 - (maybe amalgamate a 
couple)
Capital gains *sales)  are likely $50.00 for 
the first and $20.00 each after that.
Just a guideline not etched in 
stone. 
This from "ask an income trusts tax and immigration expert" 
from www.centa.com or www.jurock.com or www.featureweb.com. David Ingram deals on a daily 
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